A Conversation Between "Tomorrow and Tomorrow" Coauthors Lillah Lawson and Lauren Emily Whalen
You know those memes and reels making fun of friends who send each other ten-minute-long voice messages over messenger? Well, author Lauren Emily Whalen and I (author Lillah Lawson) are no stranger to those. We’ve fine tuned the art of the voice message over the past few years: so much so that we wrote a whole book that way!
Okay, so I’m exaggerating a tad. We did actually sit down and type out Tomorrow and Tomorrow, a gender-swapped, spooky-sexy adaptation of Macbeth, set in Athens, GA and featuring an all-girl rock n’ roll band, hot stoner boy witches and a whole bunch of murder most foul. But before any typing began, the book was hashed out entirely through long, drawn-out voice messages that grew more and more impassioned as we approached that first day in November when the first word would be typed on the first page. We often joke that the process of co-writing was so easy that the book practically wrote itself. As the author of quite a few books, and all the headaches that go with them, I know how rare that is.
Lauren, for her part, is no stranger to Shakespeare adaptations. Her books Two Winters and Take Her Down (adaptations of The Winter’s Tale and Julius Caesar, respectively) tackle the Bard’s material with a fresh, modern and beautifully diverse twist. I read and loved both, so when Lauren and I started exchanging lengthy voice messages during the pandemic, desperate to fill the long, sad and fraught hours with creative endeavors, ultimately deciding that we should write something together, I just knew: it had to be Macbeth. As a Scot-o-Phile and self-proclaimed goth girl, I figured I could add the element of geeky darkness to Lauren’s already fine tuned skills at adapting Willy Shakes. We spent a few months–me in Athens, and Lauren in Chicago–hashing out everything from the characters’ back stories to the music for our playlist, over ever-lengthier voice messages. And then one day, our bloody, sexy and very rock n’ roll novel was all finished! I couldn’t be prouder: the book is more than just a cozy horror romp–the cover is everything we are: Lauren, pink. Me, black. The mark of a friendship deepened over a pandemic.
I sat down with Lauren to chat about our upcoming release, our writing process, and more! And no, for once, I didn’t conduct the interview over voice messages! I hope you love Tomorrow and Tomorrow as much as we do.
Lillah Lawson: Hello! Hi. So you and I have been friends since…oh, 2008ish…is that right? You’ve talked before about how we were both Jezebel gals and how we met in the comment section. Can you talk a little more about that era, how we met/bonded and how those experiences led to our book?
Lauren Emily Whalen: Hi! It was 2009 (I have a very long and specific memory). I distinctly remember the Jezebel “Saturday Night Social” (for the uninitiated, it was basically an open comment thread that was a lot of fun!), when you posted, “hey, does anyone want to be Facebook friends?” Really dating myself there. You were very pregnant at the time! But yeah, we immediately clicked. I credit you with channeling my inner Goth girl—not sure if I’ve ever told you that! Anyway, two of the big things we always connected on were: a) we wanted to be published authors someday, and b) we loved Joan Jett. Like, loved. Looking back, it kind of seems inevitable we’d write a book with Joanie as our muse. What do you remember?
LL: Thanks to pregnancy brain fog, not a ton! I remember when Jezebel’s comment section imploded, you and I both migrated into a group together on Facebook where we tended to talk to each other more than everyone else, and it just stuck! Didn’t we actually burn CDs for each other at one point and send them to each other? And of course I vividly remember finally meeting you in person in 2013 (ironically, ten years to the day! The pictures were just in my Facebook memories, so how cool is this?); the very first place we went to was Jittery Joe’s for coffee, then to now-defunct The Grit (sob) for delicious food! And we got along like a house on fire, naturally.
We each took on specific characters as our “own”, writing from the POV of those characters only. However, it isn’t as cut-and-dried as “Mac is me; Duff is you” – the characters are much more nuanced than that. Which was your favorite character to write (and your favorite character in general)? Which of “my” characters is your favorite?
LEW: I have waxed poetic about my love for Quincy Banks and how I HATED to…um, end her, but it was absolutely necessary (she’s a reimagining of the Banquo character in Macbeth), so I gave even that as much heart as I possibly could. Quin is one of my favorite characters I’ve ever written. Maybe my favorite overall. There’s a reason I gave her my hair color (blonde and pink), the instrument I wish I could play (drums), and better vocal stylings than I’ll ever have. And on top of all that, she’s a proud pansexual gal! To paraphrase Juno, Quincy Banks is the coolest character and she doesn’t even try.
As for “your” characters, I just love Mac. She’s so awful to her loved ones, but she’s so complex! In some ways she reminds me of Amy Dunne in Gone Girl, one of the best fictional characters of all time. Like, I hate her but I also admire how far she’ll go and above all, her planning skills (my Capricorn rising is showing).
Now you!
LL: Oh gosh, I think I’m gonna have to go with good old Ian Duncan, the band’s manager and let’s face it, surrogate father. I wish we’d had more time with him, honestly. I feel like we put so much thought and care into developing that character that when it was time to…well, you know…I was distraught! I think he’s gonna be a fan favorite – it’s not often that you meet a savvy, successful (and wealthy!) businessman who also happens to be a great dad, a wonderful mentor, and still has a rockin’ (dad) bod.
As far as your brain children, I think I’ve gotta pick Quincy, too! She has this vulnerability that I find very captivating and downright heartbreaking; she’s like a modern-day Karen Carpenter in some ways. All she wants is to be loved.
This was the first time co-writing for both of us. And not to toot our own horn, but we did it across the country from each other, during a pandemic. What are your key takeaways from the experience?
LEW: I remember being so nervous about co-writing! Could we really write a whole novel, especially with all the obstacles you mentioned? Also, I’ll always remember going to my favorite Starbucks and having to show my ID and my vax card before I sat down to write (thank you Chicago, for keeping me safe and healthy!). And just like writing solo, there are really no concrete rules for this kind of collaboration—it’s all about what works for the writers. In our case, I think what helped the most was having a concrete schedule for the first draft—we did NaNoWriMo and alternated days, which we had determined ahead of time (not only am I a Cap rising, I’m an admin by day, so I live for a calendar!). We also communicated constantly, whether that was through our many shared Google docs—research on Scotland, character sketches, Shakespeare quotes, our full synopsis we wrote before the first draft, and the working draft itself—or through several voice messages almost every day, I appreciated always knowing where you were at with the plot, characters, story, or even just what coffee drink you got that day. Plus, when it came time to revise and edit, I loved having a built-in beta reader.
Basically, this book is brought to you by Google Drive, Facebook DM voice messages, and Starbucks. And my vax card.
LL: It’s no secret that music plays a huge part in this novel —it is about a rock n’ roll band, after all, and Queen Joan (Jett) was our muse. You and I have pretty different musical tastes with a few very key ones in common, and I think we drew on those inspirations heavily for this book. If you had to pick one song that sums up the novel completely, what would it be? Bonus question: who is your favorite musician/band from Athens, Georgia?
LEW: I’ll answer the bonus question first: REM all the way! When I was little, one of my cousins brought a boyfriend to Thanksgiving dinner, and he could play “Losing My Religion” on the guitar, which to my small-town child self was the most badass thing ever. I saw them live in the ‘90s, and I can’t even pick a favorite song because I love them all–though I’ve been watching The Bear and the show’s recurring use of “Strange Currencies” has revitalized my love for that song (and hopefully introduced it to a whole new audience!).
Hm, if our novel had a theme song…for me it’s a tie between “No Body, No Crime” by Taylor Swift and HAIM, and Charlie Daniels’ “The Devil Went Down to Georgia.” I don’t even want to explain why because I want people to read the book and draw their own conclusions!
LL: Solid choices. I always giggle that you, the Chicago gal, are the one who added Charlie Daniels to our playlist.
LEW: Hey, I grew up in downstate Illinois and they played it at every school dance! My cousin had a live band at his wedding and they played it there too—the fiddle player had someone cover his eyes during the big solo parts!
LL: If I could add an addendum to what you’ve chosen, I think I’d go with “Spider and the Fly” by goth staple London After Midnight. It’s just so Mac. A snippet of a lyric: “I close my eyes and I keep on stalking/no one’s aware of the hunger I feel”. It also references a certain tattoo on a certain thigh…
If you had to compare one of our main characters to real-life people in the music industry, who would you choose?
LEW: Oh gosh, I feel like I don’t know the music industry well enough to do this, but I WILL say that Lawrence MacLaren (our Lady Macbeth stand-in) has definite Scooter Braun vibes…#iykyk
LL: The horror community has been having some discourse about the term “cozy horror”. Some are vehemently opposed, and others quite like the idea of it. Put me in the latter camp —I daresay Tomorrow and Tomorrow could fit the bill for “cozy horror”. It’s plenty scary, but it also has a warm, comforting feel to it. How do you feel about the term “cozy horror” and how do you think it applies to our novel?
LEW: I think “cozy horror” is a perfect description for Tomorrow and Tomorrow! I love Stephen King and Ti West as much as the next pastel goth, but I never thought I’d write a horror novel. And yet, Tomorrow and Tomorrow is major cozy horror vibes: we have creepiness! We have a body count! We have a lot of shenanigans (some of them involving nudity) in the mountains and the woods! But we also have fierce love among women, a really cool hipster rock and roll setting in Athens, Georgia, and even cute scenes in coffee shops. Look at our cover: we have black and hot pink and dripping blood (endless thanks to our magnificent cover designer Celin Chen). Cozy horror forever!
LL: I feel like enough people are tucked in with their fuzzy blankets and snacks to watch classic horror films that the term “cozy horror” should not be so divisive. It’s a comfort for so many! There was similar discourse over “horroromance” a few years ago and it’s a legit genre now (as is horror erotica, or “monsterf**cking”), so I think it’ll be fine.
Where would you rather spend the night – alone, with no devices or connections to the outside world – Glamis Castle, The Georgia Guidestones, or the top of Brasstown Bald? (feel free to elaborate with as much spookiness as possible).
LEW: I would have to say Glamis Castle. First, I’ve never been to Scotland–researching Glamis Castle for our book now has me wanting to go more than ever–and I have been to Georgia. Our characters even get to have afternoon tea there, and it’s my dream that you and I will get to follow in their footsteps one day. Second, if I’m gonna be haunted, again, like our characters are in the book after tea is over, I might as well go all the way, you know? I just hope I don’t see any flies…
LL: I’m with you. I’ve been to the Guidestones at night, and while definitely creepy, I think Glamis would win by a country mile. Besides; I want to meet the ghosts there! There are so many: Lady Janet Douglas, who was burned at the stake for suspected witchcraft in 1537; the servant-boy ghost, and the most famous one: Earl Beardie, the card-playing ghost. Lauren, if you’re into “The Devil Went Down to Georgia”, you’ll like this story. One day (while still alive), the Earl went into a drunken rage because nobody would play cards with him. He raucously declared that if nobody would play, he’d just play the devil himself. Just then, there was a knock at the door. A tall, shrouded man was on the stoop, asking the Earl if he still needed a card partner. The two men shut themselves up in a small chamber in the castle and began dealing cards. A servant spied through the keyhole, seeing unnatural light imitating from the room. The Earl, catching the servant, jumped up to chastise them for spying, only to find the mysterious player gone when he reentered the chamber. And he had taken the Earl’s soul with him. Some believe it was the devil himself who had shown up that night, and the Earl has been holed up in the secret room, dealing cards, ever since – except for when he appears at the bedside of child guests in the middle of the night to terrify them, that is. Evidently he’s a real malevolent ghostie!
FMK, Hecks edition: Josh, Pete, Zak
LEW: A bit of context for our readers: The Hecks are Tomorrow and Tomorrow’s version of Macbeth’s witches/weird sisters. From the beginning, Lillah and I decided to write the witches as hot guys, and well, because it’s our book no one could stop us! Also, it meant I could dig into my background as an erotica author and write a very sexy scene involving all three guys…
I would say…F Zak (he has cool hair that is a variety of colors during the course of the story), Marry Josh (trust me, once you read the book you’ll see why!) and Kill Pete (just because I had to kill someone).
LL: Pete is definitely the F for me…but only because I like goth boys with long hair. I’ll marry Josh, because he’s a cinnamon roll. Kill Zak, if nothing else because he toys with Mac sometimes, even if she does deserve it.
Who is your favorite minor character in the novel, the one you hope nobody sleeps on?
LEW: Katherine “Granny” Devereaux, Duff’s grandma, is the novel’s badass MVP. She’s a survivor of a terrible marriage, she has the best restaurant in Hiawassee, Georgia, and she opens her home to Duff when her granddaughter needs her the most. She can make “a gracious plenty” of macaroni and cheese that will make you cry and she isn’t here for a potential suitor that just wants her shoofly pie (literally and euphemistically). In this house we protect Granny Devereaux at all costs.
LL: For me, it’s a cross between Becs Webster and Teresa-Jo (“TJ”), Mac’s long-suffering, good as gold former bestie. In a way, she’s a foil for Mac, and the type of person that Mac wishes she could be. And Becs is just a straight-up badass (one of the few occasions that Larry M’s smarmy opinion is right on the money, because he worships her, too).
Lastly: In 10 words or less, sell our book to a reader who has never heard of it before!
LEW: Not the bestseller with a similar title, but bloodier! Also: sex.
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Lauren Emily Whalen writes adult and YA fiction, creative nonfiction and books about screaming goats and Jennifer Coolidge (no, really). Her fourth novel and adult debut, Tomorrow and Tomorrow, a female rock and roll reimagining of Macbeth cowritten with Lillah Lawson, will be released October 17. Lauren is also the author of three YA novels: Satellite, Two Winters and Take Her Down.
Lauren’s essays have been published or are forthcoming in Write or Die, Blue Mesa Review, Scavengers, Jabberwock Review, Reverie and the Spring 2023 Anthology from Querencia Press. She is a regular contributor to Queerty, GO Magazine and BookPage. Lauren writes gift books for Running Press/Hachette, including The Screaming Christmas Goat, out now, and I Heart Jennifer Coolidge: A Celebration of Your Favorite Pop Culture Icon, which will be released in April 2024.
